How long to do an inspection

[Alias]

Greetings all,I probably spend anywhere from 90 seconds to 90 minutes on inspections. I rarely have more than 8 per day which helps allot time appropriately. But I have worked in situations where we had so many that we couldn't possibly do a reasonable job (30-40 a day). Glad I don't work there anymore.

BS

As BS wrote, it depends on what I am inspecting and whose (DIY'er, contractor) work I'm inspecting as to how long it will take.

I am a department of 1 and plan accordingly. Average for a residential final is about an hour as the homes here are modest. Commercial is as long as it takes.

Sue

 

[gfretwell]

This is one reason why I was happy not working for a municipality (I was a state inspector). I usually only had a few a day to do but they may have been 50-100 miles apart. With that driving to inspecting ratio, I took the time to look around. A Ufer clamp may only take a few minutes (mostly paperwork) but a rough on a wing of a hospital might be hours. I also would wait to see the violation fixed so I could pass it if that was a reasonable option.

On my own projects I have had an inspector give me a provisional "pass" if I could Email him pictures of the correction by end of day.

 

[jwelectric]

I take great offense to your comment about inspectors and do not agree with you. Please don't generalize with statements like that based on your experiences.

My experiences are the facts. Four times a year and sometimes more I stand in front of room full of first time electrical inspectors with little or no knowledge of the NEC but yet they are already doing electrical inspections.In my state someone can be hired as an inspector using a probationary certificate or be a cross trained inspector for a period of two years. During this period they must take and pass a course at a community college before they are allowed to sit for a Standard Certificate. The pass rate of these fine folks is very low simply due to the lack of knowledge they have of the adopted codes.

The same is true for the other four trades, building, mechanical, plumbing, and fire inspector instructors who teach those trades. They see the same incompetence as I see with new inspectors coming into the trade or inspectors who are cross training.

Then let’s not forget discussion boards such as this one. I bet there has never been a disagreement on this forum between contractors or inspectors now has they. When two disagree someone has a chance to learn something don’t they? But alas we do have some that are never wrong. My mom always said that when we know everything we stop learning. When we stop learning we are back to ignorance.

I am sorry if you are offended but if you are offended then so be it. It does not change the facts. I do believe I have even read post where you were asking for advice.

 

[tmurray]

My experiences are the facts. Four times a year and sometimes more I stand in front of room full of first time electrical inspectors with little or no knowledge of the NEC but yet they are already doing electrical inspections.In my state someone can be hired as an inspector using a probationary certificate or be a cross trained inspector for a period of two years. During this period they must take and pass a course at a community college before they are allowed to sit for a Standard Certificate. The pass rate of these fine folks is very low simply due to the lack of knowledge they have of the adopted codes.

The same is true for the other four trades, building, mechanical, plumbing, and fire inspector instructors who teach those trades. They see the same incompetence as I see with new inspectors coming into the trade or inspectors who are cross training.

Then let’s not forget discussion boards such as this one. I bet there has never been a disagreement on this forum between contractors or inspectors now has they. When two disagree someone has a chance to learn something don’t they? But alas we do have some that are never wrong. My mom always said that when we know everything we stop learning. When we stop learning we are back to ignorance.

I am sorry if you are offended but if you are offended then so be it. It does not change the facts. I do believe I have even read post where you were asking for advice.

You know what's worse?

Where I am there is no requirement for inspectors. We have a lot of municipalities that the inspector just happens to be a relative of the mayor. Even people who are qualified through education are sometimes completely incompetent as inspectors.

I take every deficiency discovered as a teaching opportunity for the contractor. Most contractors take advantage of this and we have a discussion and they are able to build a better product. How can I expect a contractor to listen to me and be open to criticism and be able to admit when they are wrong when I can not?

 

[steveray]

"I bet there has never been a disagreement on this forum between contractors or inspectors now has they."

You Sir....have never been in a discussion with Brudgers (no slight to you B).....But we do for the most part, get along and keep it civil. Most of us are here to learn and teach without beating other people over the head with our "look how smart I am" stick. We agree to disagree and move on. I can't get electricians here to meet working clearances or drip loop to window on the first try, nevermind read a listing.....

Back on topic.....we try not to do more than 10 stops....really it should be about 7 for average to do the job as well as it deserves...but if the Town is going to use us like a piggy bank, then so be it....

 

[Builder Bob]

Fire blocking, cutting, and notching are in all trades (ICC) .... It doesn't change a thing unless the BO is willing to allow trade inspections to overlap...... but I guess with your commitment to the electrical codes, none of the other stuff matters.

 

[jwelectric]

Fire blocking, cutting, and notching are in all trades (ICC) .... It doesn't change a thing unless the BO is willing to allow trade inspections to overlap...... but I guess with your commitment to the electrical codes, none of the other stuff matters.

I might be wrong so please help me out here. Is this not the residential electrical thread?

There is no fire rated walls in a single family dwelling. You said top plate and also used two different trades with the mention of fire caulking.

Maybe I am way out in left field here but there is no requirement in the NEC for draft stopping at all.

 

[steveray]

Sooooo....if some just pulls an electrical permit, and the electrical only inspector goes out, no need to fireblock residentially? SWEET! That will greatly cut down my correction lists!

R302.11 Fireblocking. In combustible construction, fireblocking shall be provided to cut off all concealed draft openings (both vertical and horizontal) and to form an effective fire barrier between stories, and between a top story and the roof space.

Fireblocking shall be provided in wood-frame construction in the following locations:

1. In concealed spaces of stud walls and partitions, including furred spaces and parallel rows of studs or staggered studs, as follows:

1.1. Vertically at the ceiling and floor levels.

1.2. Horizontally at intervals not exceeding 10 feet (3048 mm).

2. At all interconnections between concealed vertical and horizontal spaces such as occur at soffits, drop ceilings and cove ceilings.

3. In concealed spaces between stair stringers at the top and bottom of the run. Enclosed spaces under stairs shall comply with Section R302.7.

4. At openings around vents, pipes, ducts, cables and wires at ceiling and floor level, with an approved material to resist the free passage of flame and products of combustion. The material filling this annular space shall not be required to meet the ASTM E 136 requirements.

5. For the fireblocking of chimneys and fireplaces, see Section R1003.19.

6. Fireblocking of cornices of a two-family dwelling is required at the line of dwelling unit separation.

 

[SCBO1]

Would it be fair to say that thoose of you that do several inspections in one day have excellent plan reviewers that catch the mistakes before they appear in the project?

Are you a specialized inspector, just doing electrical or just plumbing???

pc1

 

[Frank]

It all depends--asking how long an inspection takes is like asking how much a new car costs ($12,000 to over $1,000,000) it all depends on the specifics--

IF doing rough ins in blocks of small town houses all done at the same time by the same crews large numbers can be racked up.

If dealing with a large hotel you may be all day and only get part of a rough in done.

REinspections where only looking at specific correction can also be quick.

 

[north star]

= = +

"Maybe I am way out in left field here but there is no requirement in the NEC for draft stopping at all"

From the `08 NEC, see Article 300.21, ...725.3(B), ...760.3(A), ...770.26, ...800.26, ...820.26 & 830.26.+ = =

 

[Yankee]

You know what's worse?Where I am there is no requirement for inspectors. We have a lot of municipalities that the inspector just happens to be a relative of the mayor. Even people who are qualified through education are sometimes completely incompetent as inspectors.

I take every deficiency discovered as a teaching opportunity for the contractor. Most contractors take advantage of this and we have a discussion and they are able to build a better product. How can I expect a contractor to listen to me and be open to criticism and be able to admit when they are wrong when I can not?

You know what's worse? Almost half the jurisdictions in my State have no building department, therefore no inspections at all. If I can help one guy know how to do something per code, I hope he will do so on his job "over there".

 

[Daddy-0-]

JAR.

The BO is well aware of our issues. We put in a request to hire three new inspectors (one commercial and two residential) and then HR only approved one for this year. We may get one more next year. Until then we have to suck it up and get it done.

We do use a lot of combination inspectors which is good and bad. I am comfortable doing residential combination but when I go to commercial in the near future I will be structural only.

Combination inspectors have a valuable role for a number of reasons including the ability to see the whole picture with all of its parts. Obviously you don't want a framer doing a complicated generator inspection. The value lies somewhere in the middle.

 

[Daddy-0-]

FYI. You can have a rated wall in residential if the building is constructed too close to a lot line or too close to another building.

Drilling and notching is in the plumbing code as well as the mechanical and building codes. It is up to the locality to decide which trade inspector will enforce the provision.

 

[ICE]

Sooooo....if some just pulls an electrical permit, and the electrical only inspector goes out, no need to fireblock residentially? SWEET! That will greatly cut down my correction lists!

 

[incognito]

As expected. It defies logic to think that an electrical inspector, for example, who has done nothing but electrical inspections for the last 20 years is not going to be more competent than a combination inspector who must divide his attention and continuing ed on several trades over the same time period. There is nothing more offensive than a Jack-of-all-trades inspector who rambles on about how competent they are while in the process leaving no doubt about their true abilities. I realize they are probably doing the job to the best of their abilities, but they will typically never be as knowledgable about any trade as a trade specific inspector.

Every inspection is different and will take anywhere from 5 minutes to several hours. A rough electrical for a bathroom remodel may take 5 minutes, whereas a plumbing rough for the 4th floor of a newly constructed may take 45 minutes. We only go at the pace that allows us to complete a proper inspection.I take great offense to your comment about combination inspectors and do not agree with you. We have different inspectors with multiple disciplines that are extremely competent and masterful in 3 or more trades/disciplines, especially residential work. Please don't generalize with statements like that based on your experiences.

 

[Francis Vineyard]

As I'm often reminded that states have deleted and amended the I-codes when posting questions do wonder if NC uses the NEC for IRC?

I find the NC code pages on ICC and links from this site difficult to search and not user friendly.

Francis

 

[jwelectric]

Sooooo....if some just pulls an electrical permit, and the electrical only inspector goes out, no need to fireblock residentially? SWEET! That will greatly cut down my correction lists!

You don't require the builder to get a permit? Or did the electrician wire thin air?

R302.11 Fireblocking. In combustible construction, fireblocking shall be provided to cut off all concealed draft openings (both vertical and horizontal) and to form an effective fire barrier between stories, and between a top story and the roof space.

I love North Carolina. We do things the way they are supposed to be done

DRAFTSTOP. A material, device or construction installed to restrict the movement of air within open spaces of concealed areas of building components such as crawl spaces, floor/ceiling assemblies, roof/ceiling assemblies and attics.

709.4 exceptions

5. Fireblocking or draftstopping is not required at the partition line in Group R-2 buildings that do not exceed four stories above grade plane, provided the attic space is subdivided by draftstopping into areas not exceeding 3,000 square feet (279 m2) or above every two dwelling units, whichever is smaller.

717.1 General. Fireblocking and draftstopping shall be installed in combustible concealed locations in accordance with this section. Fireblocking shall comply with Section 717.2. Draftstopping in floor/ceiling spaces and attic spaces shall comply with Sections 717.3 and 717.4, respectively. The permitted use of combustible materials in concealed spaces of buildings of Type I or II construction shall be limited to the applications indicated in Section 717.5.

717.3 Draftstopping in floors. In combustible construction, draftstopping shall be installed to subdivide floor/ceiling assemblies in the locations prescribed in Sections 717.3.2 through 717.3.3.

717.3.1 Draftstopping materials. Draftstopping materials shall not be less than1/2-inch (12.7 mm) gypsum board, 3/8-inch (9.5 mm) wood structural panel, 3/8-inch (9.5 mm) particleboard, 1-inch (25-mm) nominal lumber, cement fiberboard, batts or blankets of mineral wool or glass fiber, or other approved materials adequately supported. The integrity of draftstops shall be maintained.

 

[jwelectric]

= = +From the `08 NEC, see Article 300.21, ...725.3(B), ...760.3(A), ...770.26, ...800.26, ...820.26 & 830.26.

+ = =

Only in fire rated walls. See the post above for more information and by the way we are on the 2011 cycle

 

[jwelectric]

Fire blocking, cutting, and notching are in all trades (ICC) .... It doesn't change a thing unless the BO is willing to allow trade inspections to overlap...... but I guess with your commitment to the electrical codes, none of the other stuff matters.

Is this not the ELECTRICAL thread?

 

[jar546]

As expected. It defies logic to think that an electrical inspector, for example, who has done nothing but electrical inspections for the last 20 years is not going to be more competent than a combination inspector who must divide his attention and continuing ed on several trades over the same time period. There is nothing more offensive than a Jack-of-all-trades inspector who rambles on about how competent they are while in the process leaving no doubt about their true abilities. I realize they are probably doing the job to the best of their abilities, but they will typically never be as knowledgable about any trade as a trade specific inspector.

We are always entitled to our opinions. Opinions should never be confused with facts, however. We are all different and have different levels of intelligence. Some people are much more capable than others. Others should not be in the job they currently are, even if it is just 1 discipline. I just love generalization statements. I can refer you to an electrical only inspector who is nothing short of a bafoon.

 

[jwelectric]

As I'm often reminded that states have deleted and amended the I-codes when posting questions do wonder if NC uses the NEC for IRC? I find the NC code pages on ICC and links from this site difficult to search and not user friendly.

Francis

We use the North Carolina codes which are the ICC codes with amendments for building, plumbing, and mechanical and the 2011 NEC. In NC we do not fireblock in single family dwellings. We do draft stop between the crawl space and attic. Being this is a building rule the electrical inspector cannot say one word as draft stop is not found in the NEC.

Electrical, plumbing, and building inspector are on the job at the same time, be it the same person or three different people. Does the electrical inspector turn down the electrician and the plumbing inspector turn down the plumber for a building violation or does the building inspector turn down the building contractor for a building violation?

How about bath fans and smoke alarms, are these something that electrical inspectors look to see if they are installed? Please show me in the National Electrical Code where either are required. If they are present during your inspection check them for compliance but if they are not there what are you going to do?

Here in the best state in the union it is against the law for an electrical contractor to install a bath fan. This little unit belongs to the mechanical contractor as it is part of the HVAC installation.

 

[Builder Bob]

I love North Carolina. We do things the way they are supposed to be done.

Opinion only...... just like other parts.

The highest area of fire fatality is from single family residences and North Carolina apparently fails to do simple basic fire prevention efforts to slow the growth rate of fire in a single family residence. The codes had changes from balloon framing several decades ago.....

a electrical short in the basement wall appears to have the potential in North Carolina to travel upward into concealed spaces between floors, upward thorughwalls, and eventually into the attic ----- because they don't use fire blocking or draft-stopping in single family residences?

And we do things right??? Wow !

 

[jwelectric]

I love North Carolina. We do things the way they are supposed to be done.Opinion only...... just like other parts.

The highest area of fire fatality is from single family residences and North Carolina apparently fails to do simple basic fire prevention efforts to slow the growth rate of fire in a single family residence. The codes had changes from balloon framing several decades ago.....

a electrical short in the basement wall appears to have the potential in North Carolina to travel upward into concealed spaces between floors, upward thorughwalls, and eventually into the attic ----- because they don't use fire blocking or draft-stopping in single family residences?

And we do things right??? Wow !

Did you read this? http://www.thebuildingcodeforum.com/forum/residential-electrical-codes/10271-how-long-do-inspection-3.html#post96021Don't need fire stop to stop a fire from entering a wall cavity and if people think that inserting something into a drilled hole that is going to do nothing but leave balls laying in the ashes is going to save a wood structure they sure don’t have very much fire knowledge.