• Welcome to the new and improved Building Code Forum. We appreciate you being here and hope that you are getting the information that you need concerning all codes of the building trades. This is a free forum to the public due to the generosity of the Sawhorses, Corporate Supporters and Supporters who have upgraded their accounts. If you would like to have improved access to the forum please upgrade to Sawhorse by first logging in then clicking here: Upgrades

Request of Variance

ADAguy said:
Have you considered a lotline adjustment to enlarge your property?
Click to expand...
No never considered that, will look into it. We were told we could build in that area, as long as it was not a certain distance from the middle of the street. We are seeking approval first so that we can get the engineer involved and order the building.
 
ihavefaith, from your photo can you clarify my understanding / assumptions, just to make sure we are all using the correct terminology, so that we can all have the same understanding of your particular issue:
1. The property line between your property and the city property (the public right-of-way / street) is the vertical face of the concrete curb.
2. The grassy area between the face of curb and the blue horizontal line in your photo represents the area on your own property where the city zoning code would normally prohibit construction of a building.
3. You are seeking to encroach into that area by two feet with some type of vertical construction - - a fence, a carport, an occupiable building - - something that is not normally allowed in that area.
4. Somebody at the city has told you that the process for doing this is called a "variance".
Please confirm if those statements are correct. Also, it would be super helpful if the city staff provided you with the specific code section reference / citation that would normally limit your ability to build in this area.

If all my assumptions are correct, then you are likely dealing with a municipal zoning code issue, not a building code issue. We can be more helpful if you can confirm the above 4 statements.
 
Yikes said:
ihavefaith, from your photo can you clarify my understanding / assumptions, just to make sure we are all using the correct terminology, so that we can all have the same understanding of your particular issue:
1. The property line between your property and the city property (the public right-of-way / street) is the vertical face of the concrete curb.
2. The grassy area between the face of curb and the blue horizontal line in your photo represents the area on your own property where the city zoning code would normally prohibit construction of a building.
3. You are seeking to encroach into that area by two feet with some type of vertical construction - - a fence, a carport, an occupiable building - - something that is not normally allowed in that area.
4. Somebody at the city has told you that the process for doing this is called a "variance".
Please confirm if those statements are correct. Also, it would be super helpful if the city staff provided you with the specific code section reference / citation that would normally limit your ability to build in this area.

If all my assumptions are correct, then you are likely dealing with a municipal zoning code issue, not a building code issue. We can be more helpful if you can confirm the above 4 statements.
Click to expand...
1. That area is designated for some use or owned by the City or some entity in some way. I asked the zoning department what the area was used for, and the person could not tell me exactly what it was, I am assuming they didn't know. I assume it is included with the street. I have spoken to the same person several times. They always direct me to this person. I assume right of way.
2. That area is not part of our property, but where our property line actually ends. So Our property ends at the line. I've gotten several responses with what it may be. Possibly the public right of way begins right there.
3. Will have a building crossing in that area.
4. We were told not to seek a variance, but to show that we are within a certain distance from the middle of the street. I know I titled this thread variance, but I was unsure what to call this.
 
I am guessing city property for future sidewalk.

Have the meeting with the big bosses,,,,

Building official!!! He will direct if you can build on the property or not,,, if you can what steps you have to take

City/ county maps do not show that area as an easement???


Have you had the property surveyed ???
 
cda said:
I am guessing city property for future sidewalk.

Have the meeting with the big bosses,,,,

Building official!!! He will direct if you can build on the property or not,,, if you can what steps you have to take

City/ county maps do not show that area as an easement???


Have you had the property surveyed ???
Click to expand...
Yes, we have a survey from when we bought the property. Says nothing about the area in question, just shows the property line ending there
 
Do you mean vacate? Building on property you don't own isn't really a building code or planning and zoning issue. There is no variance that gives you rights to someone else's property, not even the city's property.

You can buy the land or they can vacate it.
 
This is a Local issue that we cannot help with. To many variables. Would still be best to set up a meeting with the planning & zoning people of the city and discuss with them.

Here it would be a great big NO. Make it fit on your property and with in the required set backs. Especially for new construction. Other options would be to redesign or just not build. ROW are for vehicles and utilities, not structures. Be like building a shed in the neighbors yard. Most City's won't vacate any of the ROW due to setting a precedence cause way to many problems.
 
Yikes said:
The property line between your property and the city property (the public right-of-way / street) is the vertical face of the concrete curb.
Click to expand...
Why would the curb be the PL? Usually there is a ROW that extends several feet beyond the edge of pavement.
 
ihavefaith and ehilton, based on ihavefaith's responses in #29 and 31, I would concur that this is city property. Therefore we are not talking about a vacriane.

In planning, when we talk about "street" or "public right of way", it can encompass many things and uses. The part that cars can drive on is the "roadway", and 13' is often the minimum for fire truck access. The additional land is for unidentified future uses, such as sidewalk, street trees or other parkway landscaping, city utilities, or future road widening (if traffic increases on your road in the future). If it's on a corner intersectin, sometimes the extra width is needed so that drivers can see cars and pedestrians coming from the other street.

What the city is likely asking you to do is to apply for an "encroachment permit in the public right of way".
Examples of this may include theatre marquee or awning hanging out over a public sidewalk, outdoor sidewalk dining for a restaurant, newspaper stands, etc.
In some cases in high crime neighborhoods I have seen cities grant permits to private property owners to install fencing on the public right-of-way, because the other members of the public were abusing the city property. Rarely do I see cities grant something expensive and seemingly permanent (such as occupiable building space) under a revocable permit.

Most cities will ask for this to be a "revocable" permit, meaning that they have the right to kick you off of their land at any time. If it were permanent, that process is more likely a partial "street abandonment", where the land ownership would revert to you. Many cities will also require a bond to be posted, equal to the future value of demolishing whatever it is that you build there.

The reason it is so difficult to grant a street abandonment is that there is little to no upside for the benefit of the community. What if thy do want to install sidewalks in the future, or widen the roadway for more traffic, and they can't do it because your building is in the way?

Therefore, your greatest likelihood of success is to explain to them:
- What makes your situation unique, that this extra couple of feet is really critical to your use of the property. "We need to install a wheelchair ramp in the yard to help my mother get into the house" is a good example.
- Why there risk or downside for the city, or potential loss of future use by the city. If your construction is temporary, or easily removed, and if the city won't have to pay out of their own pocket to remove it in the future, that's a much better sell.
- How the construction may be of benefit to the city (if applicable). "I'd like to build a park bench where the neighborhood kids can sit while they wait for the school bus", etc.
 
As you can see, you have a pickle. This issue should have been apparent in your properties Title Report.
 
In our residential subdivision we typically have a Right-of-Way (ROW) that is 11-ft. the sidewalk is typically set 9-10ft from the back of curb to back of sidewalk. that extra 1-2ft was usually where the water meter pit was located. I was told a long time ago they use to read meters and that the meter reader would be able to stay off private property to read the meter and utilize the sidewalk. Not an issue with radio read meters.

City aren't to keen giving up ROW, in most cases they'd like some more. Oh.. there's some utilities in most cases on both sides of the road, we don't let you build over those, do you know if there's utilities in that 13ft area? in case I skipped over that some where?
 
cda said:
Might be swamp land, the city wants to get rid of.

Have seen it happen
Click to expand...
Well, I take that back. I do remember maybe two times where the village I work for owned weird small pieces of land and were willing to sell them off when the correct offer for development arose.
 
rktect 1 said:
Well, I take that back. I do remember maybe two times where the village I work for owned weird small pieces of land and were willing to sell them off when the correct offer for development arose.
Click to expand...


Or have seen land swaps also.
 
rktect 1 said:
Well, I take that back. I do remember maybe two times where the village I work for owned weird small pieces of land and were willing to sell them off when the correct offer for development arose.
Click to expand...
Yeah, but probably not between the street and the front prop line because the HO wants a larger building.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top