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Shouldn't my architect know the building use codes and not need to call zoning?

J

jlfitz67

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I have a estimate from the architect for a drawing and he like... doesn't know the codes. I am putting a pottery studio in a retail space and will have a mix of classes and retail.

I have done all the homework on this myself, met with building officials, fire marshals, had an engineer do a site plan review and now I just need a drawing for the submission of the plan to move a sink and install a kiln. From EVERYTHING I have researched (and asked on here) it is not a change of use, it is classified currently as "B" Business and the architect wants to charge me for the time it takes him to figure this out with calls to zoning?
I just need a stamped drawing and the quote is now over 2000.00 with the ONLY change in the space being moving the sink and install of the kiln.

no walls, no cabinets installed no nothing. I also gave them the previous file with 89 pages of documents, the original drawings etc.. they have all the measurements, I even gave them the measurements of the furniture which the building official said he doesn't need. just wants to see where in the space which activity happens.
 
If you want him to sign your drawings, he/she needs to verify EVERYTHING.
You are asking him to put his/her license in your hands, I think not.
There is a reason a license Design professional is required.
 
90% of the time it's the owner, buyer or seller calling me, not the Architect. The Architect's will on occasion call and ask what codes we are on?

After I receive the plans for review, I usually have questions for the Architect.

How the Architect gets paid is between his client and him/her.
 
mark handler said:
If you want him to sign your drawings, he/she needs to verify EVERYTHING.
You are asking him to put his/her license in your hands, I think not.
There is a reason a license Design professional is required.
Click to expand...
I am not asking him to sign my drawings, I am asking for one drawing with all of the information provided and he has already been to the space. He is adding in all kinds of costs for calls to zoning, building etc...

I am not stupid thanks.
 
If a drawing from an architect or engineer is required for the permit, pretty sure it has to be sealed and signed. If another problem arises during construction, pretty sure that the architect who signed the drawing will be found responsible. Even if they are not, it will take their time.

Is your agreement with the architect a stipulated sum or hourly?
 
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if you look at my original question...shouldn't they know the uses and codes for the sq footage of a space "B" business and not need to chage me for making phone calls. Have a great day,
 
mark handler said:
If you want him to sign your drawings, he/she needs to verify EVERYTHING.
You are asking him to put his/her license in your hands, I think not.
There is a reason a license Design professional is required.
Click to expand...
And in there lies the crux of the issue.

While I can understand that jlfitz69 has done some leg work, he is not a required licensed design professional. For whatever reason, these days people think they can do their homework and simply ask another to execute it for them. I can tell my doctor what is wrong with me and diagnose my symptoms and tell him/her to prescribe me my sinus infection RX so why should I pay him/her more than $10 for that script?
 
bill1952 said:
If a drawing from an architect or engineer is required for the permit, pretty sure it has to be sealed and signed. If another problem arises during construction, pretty sure that the architect who signed the drawing will be found responsible. Even if they are not, it will take their time.

Is your agreement with the architect a stipulated sum or hourly?
Click to expand...
It is literally for moving a sink from one side of the wall to the other. Zero other changes. Pulling permits for installing a vent (much like a dryer vent) which will be done by the HVAC contractor, the electrical, which will be done by the electrician, and the sink move is to be done by the plumber. There is no construction, no demolition, no fixtures, nothing. We already have had engineer look at space and provide recommendations.
 
jlfitz67 said:
It is literally for moving a sink from one side of the wall to the other. Zero other changes. Pulling permits for installing a vent (much like a dryer vent) which will be done by the HVAC contractor, the electrical, which will be done by the electrician, and the sink move is to be done by the plumber. There is no construction, no demolition, no fixtures, nothing. We already have had engineer look at space and provide recommendations.
Click to expand...
Have the Engineer prepare and sign the drawings for you....
 
rktect 1 said:
And in there lies the crux of the issue.

While I can understand that jlfitz69 has done some leg work, he is not a required licensed design professional. For whatever reason, these days people think they can do their homework and simply ask another to execute it for them. I can tell my doctor what is wrong with me and diagnose my symptoms and tell him/her to prescribe me my sinus infection RX so why should I pay him/her more than $10 for that script?
Click to expand...
Inspector Gadget said:
So you're plansplaining to an architect?

Let me know how that works out for you.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the help. what a friendly bunch you are.
 
Are you certain that scope of work requires a building permit rather than just a trade permit? A trade permit is something a plumber can pull same day for moving the sink. The kiln likely requires an electrical permit to install the new outlet.
 
jlfitz67 said:
It is literally for moving a sink from one side of the wall to the other. Zero other changes. Pulling permits for installing a vent (much like a dryer vent) which will be done by the HVAC contractor, the electrical, which will be done by the electrician, and the sink move is to be done by the plumber. There is no construction, no demolition, no fixtures, nothing. We already have had engineer look at space and provide recommendations.
Click to expand...
I am still wondering why an architect was required.
 
jlfitz67 said:
Thanks for the help. what a friendly bunch you are.
Click to expand...
Several professionals in this field have told you -politely - that you're overstepping your bounds by trying to circumvent the work the architect has to discharge in a certain function in order to mitigate liabilities, and you have pressed the point, suggesting a professional is - to be blunt - incompetent, when in reality you've already demonstrated the fact that for all the "research" you have done, you don't know as much as you think you do.

Let's review a critical statement:
jlfitz67 said:
it is not a change of use, it is classified currently as "B" Business and the architect wants to charge me for the time it takes him to figure this out with calls to zoning?
Click to expand...

Zoning is entirely different from building code occupancy.

Example: we had a veterinary clinic want to move into an office occupied by doctors. People looking after people, people looking after critters. No difference, right?
WRONG. The land was not zoned for a veterinary clinic. The minor alterations proposed for the building didn't represent a change of occupancy under Code, but DID represent a change of use under zoning.

Your architect - who I would suggest actually knows what's involved here - is doing due diligence. You can either believe us or, as you seem intent on doing, not.
 
bill1952 said:
I am still wondering why an architect was required.
Click to expand...
Even the engineer suggested it is not really necessary as I have all of the original drawings, and the bldg dept said he just needs to see where each activity is taking place, (classes vs retail) and so, I wish they told me this in the first place. It is very confusing to me, like I even measured every piece of furniture. It's ok I just wondered in my original question, wouldn't the architect know what the "use" classification would be without charging me to make phone calls. sorry everyone
 
Inspector Gadget said:
Several professionals in this field have told you -politely - that you're overstepping your bounds by trying to circumvent the work the architect has to discharge in a certain function in order to mitigate liabilities, and you have pressed the point, suggesting a professional is - to be blunt - incompetent, when in reality you've already demonstrated the fact that for all the "research" you have done, you don't know as much as you think you do.

Let's review a critical statement:


Zoning is entirely different from building code occupancy.

Example: we had a veterinary clinic want to move into an office occupied by doctors. People looking after people, people looking after critters. No difference, right?
WRONG. The land was not zoned for a veterinary clinic. The minor alterations proposed for the building didn't represent a change of occupancy under Code, but DID represent a change of use under zoning.

Your architect - who I would suggest actually knows what's involved here - is doing due diligence. You can either believe us or, as you seem intent on doing, not.
Click to expand...
I am well aware of this thanks. I am not trying to circumvent anything in fact, the opposite How do I delete my account from this garbage forum? Did you read what I wrote? The question was "Shouldn't they know the use codes?"
 
ZONING CODE: Relates to land use, are you allowed to have a factory in a residential neighborhood.

BUILDING CODE: deals with safety and technical related requirements such as Building systems, fire safety requirements, structural loads, maximum occupancy loads, mechanical/electrical/plumbing requirements just to name a few.

You seem to be confusing these unrelated issues/codes.
 
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