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Solar

Darren Emery said:
Is there a code reference for this? We're just starting to see PV panels around here, and we are trying our best to get up to speed on all requirements.
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The california fire guys wrote that for FF to get around on a roof...not sure how many other places use their guidelines....
 
Our local fire department will do a site visit prier to the pv install and go over the plans with installers, then give us the thumbs up, works out nicely
 
Chad Pasquini said:
Our local fire department will do a site visit prier to the pv install and go over the plans with installers, then give us the thumbs up, works out nicely
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We have way too much of it for that.
 
yea I am sure of that ice, we have two consistent installers and every once in while a large company will come in and do an apartment complex, but the two local companies are on the ball most of the time as they will meet with fire department a couple of months ahead of scheduled job.
 
Conarb, I can't quote the actual code section but I know the State Fire Marshall's Office came out with setbacks from ridge and eaves.
 
The 2012 I.F.C. addresses this in Section 605.11. Section 605.11.3.2.3 requires 18" clearance to the valley. I don't see a reference to the IFC in the IRC but, Section 3111.1 of the IBC references the IFC so, it is enforceable here for commercial buildings. GPE
 
The reason I ask is the Piedmont fire:

KTVU said:
Piedmont Fire Capt. Dave Swan told KTVU Saturday that solar-powered systems can pose a threat to firefighters even if crews shut off the flow of power from PG&E and the panels.“We know that even if we find the switch, to shut off the photo-voltaic flow into the house that there's still energy all the way from the panels down to the switch,” said Swan.

As of Saturday, the State of California was considering new building codes and firefighters say they're hoping those new codes will reflect their concerns about solar power installation.

“We have great hopes that it will do two things: it'll make it easier for people to safely install photo-voltaics so we can see more friendly energy being used, and it will make it safer for firefighters to work as well,” said Swan

.

Fire officials told KTVU that until the building codes catch up, the key for consumers considering solar was to find reputable installers and check with their city's fire department for their recommendations.¹
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I served on the Design Review Commission in Piedmont 35 years ago, there are many beautiful mansions in Piedmont, no way defacing a home with solar panels would have gotten by me, of course California probably has a law that youi can't stop them now. The are already making widows as solar panels in Germany, if someone really wants them that's what they should do.

¹ http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/local/solar-panels-proving-be-dangerous-firefighters/nZ9w4/
 
steveray said:
The california fire guys wrote that for FF to get around on a roof...not sure how many other places use their guidelines....
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OLD CALIFORNIA DEPARTMENT of FORESTRY and FIRE PROTECTION

OFFICE OF THE STATE FIRE MARSHAL

SOLAR PHOTOVOLTAIC INSTALLATION GUIDELINE

http://osfm.fire.ca.gov/pdf/reports/solarphotovoltaicguideline.pdf

This is more up to date:

California Solar Permitting Guidebook

The Governor’s Office of Planning and Research

http://opr.ca.gov/docs/California_Solar_Permitting_Guidebook.pdf
 
Thanks Mark, I've saved it in my 2013 code folder.

A quick reading indicates that these guidelines are not in the codes, but local AHJs are encouraged to adopt them as local ordinances. Looking at just a few of the guidelines:



Solar Permitting Guidebook said:
4. Roof drainage: Roof-mounted solar PV systems shall not cause excessive sagging of the roof that results in water ponding. They shall also not block or impede drainage flows to roof drains and scuppers. (CBC Section 1611, CRC Section R903.4)



5. Roof penetrations:

All roof penetrations shall be sealed using approved methods and products to prevent water leakage. Such methods include but not limited to caulking, roof jacks, and sheet metal flashing. (CBC Section 1503.2, CRC Section R903.2)



6. Skylights:

Solar PV panels shall maintain a minimum clearance around the perimeter of skylights as not to interfere with the function of the skylight, as determined by the enforcing agency. (CBC Section 1205, CRC Section R303)



7. Plumbing vent, mechanical equipment, and mechanical exhaust terminations:

Solar PV panels shall not obstruct or interfere with the function of plumbing vents or mechanical equipment. (CPC Sections 901.1 & 906, CMC Section 304)



8. Guard rails:



When required by the enforcing agency, guard rails may apply to solar PV systems. (CBC1013.5).



9. Disabled access requirement.
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From reading this I take it that an AHJ could require guardrails around solar panels, and sufficient space around the panels for disabled access, I also read it as requiring local AHJs to either develop prescriptive engineering requirements or require engineering.

 
As a document, the guidelines are not code. but most sections are in other portions of the CCR T24, including the energy and green codes
 
When applying for a permit the building departments always send me to the fire marshal for their approval if the project is of any size, when a solar contractor comes in to get a permit does the building department send him to the fire marshal for approval to enforce the fire code?
 
conarb said:
I also read it as requiring local AHJs to either develop prescriptive engineering requirements or require engineering.
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We don't require engineering unless the roof covering is tile.

The reasoning behind it is that the PV equipment doesn't weigh much and it pretty much eliminates the live load.

I eyeball the rafter tails to see that the supports line up with the rafters. I guess that's a form of engineering because every now and then I determine that the roof structure just isn't up to the task.
 
ICE said:
We don't require engineering unless the roof covering is tile. The reasoning behind it is that the PV equipment doesn't weigh much and it pretty much eliminates the live load.

I eyeball the rafter tails to see that the supports line up with the rafters. I guess that's a form of engineering because every now and then I determine that the roof structure just isn't up to the task.
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Tiger:

Better read the guildlines that Mark posted, it looks like you have to require it, or come up with prescriptive requirements.
 
conarb said:
When applying for a permit the building departments always send me to the fire marshal for their approval if the project is of any size, when a solar contractor comes in to get a permit does the building department send him to the fire marshal for approval to enforce the fire code?
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We don't even send them to the planning dept.

Expired permits or code enforcement actions are not an impediment to obtaining a permit for PV.

It has been proposed that we open an office on Saturdays just for solar permitting and all plans will be approved over the counter.

The goal is a standard plan that can be approved in minutes.

I heard a well known building official tell a packed auditorium that the inspection of PV should be no more difficult or time consuming than inspecting a water heater. At that same seminar I heard that there is a push to let the solar industry self certify their installations.

That's a great idea.

This is all because of pressure from Sacramento.
 
conarb said:
Tiger:Better read the guildlines that Mark posted, it looks like you have to require it, or come up with prescriptive requirements.
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There's lots of stuff that we ignore.
 
ICE said:
There's lots of stuff that we ignore.
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Why can't everybody ignore the stupid accessibility stuff then? It appears that you enforce what you want to enforce and ignore what you don't want to enforce, so enforcement is a function of political correctness?
 
( & - & )



" ...so enforcement is a function of political correctness?"
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IMO, ...absolutely !........Is that so hard to believe ?....Again, IMO, but a lotof AHJ's do not want their code officials thinking too much, but rather,

to be an expendable puppet by which their own agendas are being carried

out, and enforcement [ or conversely, "non-enforcement" ] is just part of

the game of trying to remain employed with that particular AHJ.



( & - & )
 
Speaking of agenda, I was reading our 2013 Green Code and found this:

2013 California Green Code said:
GLOBAL WARMING POTENTIAL VALUE (GWP VALUE).The 100-year GWP value published by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) in either its Second Assessment Report (SAR) (IPCC, 1995); or its Fourth Assessment A-3 Report (AR4) (IPCC, 2007). The SAR GWP values are found in column "SAR (100-yr)" of Table 2.14.; the AR4 GWP values are found in column "lOOyr" of Table 2.14.
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So now the Green Police are going to be enforcing the Agenda of the United Nations by reference when they enforce codes, when Bush 1 signed the United Nations Agenda for the 21st century we were told not to worry. that it was non-binding, seems like it is now binding.
 
conarb said:
So now the Green Police are going to be enforcing the Agenda of the United Nations
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laff.gif
 
When it finally starts raining again there's gonna be a lot of unhappy homeowners.







Wadaya wanna bet that we get blamed.
 
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