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Woodstove installed in sunroom

Discussion in 'Residential Energy Codes' started by Rick18071, Dec 26, 2018.

  1. Rick18071

    Rick18071 Sawhorse

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    I'm trying to find a way out for a friend that is installing a wood stove in a sunroom so the sunroom does need to have or upgrade insulation as the local inspector is requiring. Sunroom is finished and the existing if any insulation is unknown.

    2015 IECC under existing buildings:(The sunroom code book let's you use the IECC)
    R503.2 Change in space conditioning. Any nonconditioned
    or low-energy space that is altered to become conditioned
    space shall be required to be brought into full compliance
    with this code.
    Exception: Where the simulated performance option in
    Section R405 is used to comply with this section, the
    annual energy cost of the proposed design is permitted to
    be 110 percent of the annual energy cost otherwise
    allowed by Section R405.3.

    I was thinking he could say he had a portable heater in the sunroom and it is not being changed from a nonconditioned to a conditioned space. Would you accept that?


    Or how would you prove that the sunroom would meet this exception? Would the existing wall between the house and the sunroom need to be brought up to the 2015 code?

    2015 IRC 1102.1.Exceptions
    The following low energy buildings or portions thereof, separated from the remainder of the building
    by building thermal envelope assemblies complying with
    this section
    shall be exempt from the building thermal
    envelope provisions of Section N1102.
    1. Those with a peak design rate of energy usage less
    than 3.4 Btu/h ยท ft2 (10.7 W/m2) or 1.0 watt/ft2 of
    floor area for space conditioning purposes.
    2. Those that do not contain conditioned space.

    Also if someone put a wood stove or fireplace on a patio would you require them to build a insulated room around it?
     
  2. VillageInspector

    VillageInspector Sawhorse

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    By installing a source of heat you are changing an non conditioned space into a conditioned space. in so far as your patio question goes the outside patio is not considered a space in that its not contained by four walls and a roof.
     
  3. steveray

    steveray Sawhorse

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    If the sunroom was thermally isolated (door/windows/walls of any type)...I do not think I would worry too much....
     
  4. Rick18071

    Rick18071 Sawhorse

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    Not sure what you mean. The inspector is requiring insulation to the 2015 IRC
     
  5. steveray

    steveray Sawhorse

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    If someone wants to add on and can't meet the energy code, as long as that area has a door to close it off from the house, we are good...The wood stove does make it a little tricky. We have an amendment that allows "onsite" wood....


    (Amd) R402.1 General (Prescriptive). The building thermal envelope shall meet the
    requirements of Sections R402.1.1 through R402.1.5.
    Exception: The following low-energy buildings, or portions thereof, separated from the
    remainder of the building by building thermal envelope assemblies complying with this section
    shall be exempt from the building thermal envelope provisions of Section R402:
    1. Those with a peak design rate of energy usage less than 3.4 Btu/h ft2 or 1.0 watts per
    square foot (watt/ft2) of floor area for space conditioning purposes.
    2. Those that do not contain conditioned space.
    3. Buildings and structures for which heating and cooling is supplied solely by utilization of
    non-purchased renewable energy sources including, but not limited to, on-site wind, onsite
    water or on-site solar power, or wood-burning heating appliances that do not rely on
    backup heat from other purchased, non-renewable sources.
     
    Enrgxprt likes this.
  6. cda

    cda Sawhorse

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    Call it a patio??

    Is there just a walk thru door into the house

    Or bigger opening??
     
  7. Rick18071

    Rick18071 Sawhorse

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    I don't know the size of the door into the sunroom from the house.
    I just need something from the IECC to show to the local inspector that it does not need to meet the energy code.
     
  8. Rick18071

    Rick18071 Sawhorse

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    I told him that it would pass if he took the windows out, then it would be considered non conditioned. Then he could put the windows back after the C. O. Don't need a permit here for installing windows where there is no structure issues.

    Other ideas?
     
  9. steveray

    steveray Sawhorse

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    Put the woodstove in later? But yours almost sounds code compliant.....
     
  10. mtlogcabin

    mtlogcabin Registered User

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    If you are only adding a wood stove to the sun room then that is not an alteration by definition, so 503.2 is not applicable

    ALTERATION. Any construction, retrofit or renovation to an existing structure other than repair or addition. Also, a change in a building, electrical, gas, mechanical or plumbing system that involves an extension, addition or change to the arrangement, type or purpose of the original installation.

    A wood stove is not a mechanical system by definition
    [MP] MECHANICAL SYSTEM. A system specifically addressed and regulated in this code and composed of components, devices, appliances and equipment.

    This is a non-habital room/space since it currently does not meet section R303.10 Required Heating

    The energy code only requires a change of occupancy to comply with the code if there is an increase in demand for fossil fuels or electricity. Wood is not a fossil fuel so R505.1 does not apply

    R505.1 General.
    Spaces undergoing a change in occupancy that would result in an increase in demand for either fossil fuel or electrical energy shall comply with this code.
     
    ICE and my250r11 like this.
  11. FLSTF01

    FLSTF01 Registered User

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    A woodstove is not thermostatically-controlled. I wouldn't bother with it. Take a permit to install a woodstove as supplemetal heat and move on to bigger fish.
     
  12. No Soup for you

    No Soup for you Registered User

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    I agree, with the above. The room will not be T-stat controlled from the main heating unit and the stove only operated occasionally as supplemental heat.
     
  13. cda

    cda Sawhorse

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    Welcome

    What do you do for a living?
     
  14. ICE

    ICE Moderator

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    My first thought also. I'm surprised it was the tenth post before the obvious answer surfaced.
     
  15. steveray

    steveray Sawhorse

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    So putting a wood stove in is not construction and we should not require a permit for it?
     
  16. mtlogcabin

    mtlogcabin Registered User

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    A mechanical permit would be required however the energy code would not be applicable for the wood stove installation since the wood stove is a solid fuel burning appliance and not a fossil fuel burning appliance
     
  17. No Soup for you

    No Soup for you Registered User

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    Building Inspector

    I would NEVER make someone do what the original poster is going through.

    Yes it "maybe" now be considered conditioned space with the wood stove but much the same if they added a fireplace instead of a wood stove. In my opinion.

    I would never break someones
    Thanks for the "Welcome"
    I have been in commercial and residential construction for 28 years. The guy with the hardhat and the tie (Site Supervisor/Project Manager), and now a Building Inspector for 8 years, I just found this site yesterday. :)

    With regards to the question of , do you need a permit for a wood stove? If your house burns down and you didnt have one your insurance company will tell you to have a nice day.
     
  18. steveray

    steveray Sawhorse

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    That is great that you have the ability to ignore code requirements in your jurisdiction, we do not...

    (Amd) R104.1 General. The building official is hereby authorized and directed to enforce the
    provisions of this code. The building official shall have the authority to adopt policies and
    procedures in order to clarify the application of its provisions. Such policies and procedures shall
    be in compliance with the intent and purpose of this code. Such policies and procedures shall not
    have the effect of waiving requirements specifically provided for in this code, nor shall they have
    the effect of establishing requirements in excess of those set forth in this code.

    They call it negligence here...And it is a criminal offense just like other violations of the building code...
     
  19. mtlogcabin

    mtlogcabin Registered User

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    wood by definition is not one of the 4 "Fossil Fuels" and therefore is not regulated by the energy code. So you are not ignoring the energy code requirements you cannot legally apply them to the installation of a wood stove.

    Overview of the Four Fossil Fuels
    The four types of fossil fuels are petroleum, coal, natural gas and Orimulsion(capitalized because it is a proprietary, or trade, name). They have a number of important physical, chemical and other properties in common, but perhaps the most critical fact about fossil fuels is that they are not renewable. Once they are used up, that's it; many more millions of years have to pass before even small amounts can be made again, assuming the same processes will ever even occur on the same scale.
     
  20. steveray

    steveray Sawhorse

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    I do not believe my energy code exempts wood burning appliances....As much as maybe I think it should...

    N1102.4.2 (R402.4.2) Fireplaces. New wood-burning
    fireplaces
    shall have tight-fitting flue dampers or doors,
    and outdoor combustion air. Where using tight-fitting
    doors on factory-built fireplaces listed and labeled in
    accordance with UL 127, the doors shall be tested and
    listed for the fireplace. Where using tight-fitting doors on
    masonry fireplaces, the doors shall be listed and labeled in
    accordance with UL 907.

    N1101.2 (R101.3) Intent. This chapter shall regulate the
    design and construction of buildings for the effective use and
    conservation of energy over the useful life of each building.
    This chapter is intended to provide flexibility to permit the
    use of innovative approaches and techniques to achieve this
    objective. This chapter is not intended to abridge safety,
    health or environmental requirements contained in other
    applicable codes or ordinances.
     

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