• Welcome to the new and improved Building Code Forum. We appreciate you being here and hope that you are getting the information that you need concerning all codes of the building trades. This is a free forum to the public due to the generosity of the Sawhorses, Corporate Supporters and Supporters who have upgraded their accounts. If you would like to have improved access to the forum please upgrade to Sawhorse by first logging in then clicking here: Upgrades

Help, please.....

The latest: I sent an email this morning to everyone at City Hall and the Fire Marshall's office connected with codes, inspections and fire safety. I asked for a meeting so that we could present our research and have our say. Got a call back from an inspector, first thing said was we will have your meeting but our minds will not change. A meeting was scheduled for tomorrow morning....... I then spoke to my husband. We both agreed we did not want to go to a meeting, that was disguised as a fair hearing. That's exactly what I said in our post declining to attend. The gentleman from City Hall also said that we would not get a different response from the state level. That however will be our next step. Failure there will dictate hiring an attorney. Are you guys sure there should be handrails on those stairs? I am :)
 
Thanks JPohling. When this is over I'm going to make a donation to this site and a donation to St. Jude's Hospital in the name of the good people at BCF. My husband told me tonight that he was proud of me. He is of course having a lot of difficulty with details and I think he is reassured that I'm taking care of business. I tell you though....the way the bldg. inspector talked to me today; took away some of my confidence...so I just come back here to replenish. The inspector was annoyed, abrupt, and let me know in no uncertain terms that I still did not have a case, and that would be exactly what they would tell us at the meeting. The meeting by the way would be attended by the three reps that have already said no to us. Okay..... onward.....
 
oldred said:
Thanks JPohling. When this is over I'm going to make a donation to this site and a donation to St. Jude's Hospital in the name of the good people at BCF. My husband told me tonight that he was proud of me. He is of course having a lot of difficulty with details and I think he is reassured that I'm taking care of business. I tell you though....the way the bldg. inspector talked to me today; took away some of my confidence...so I just come back here to replenish. The inspector was annoyed, abrupt, and let me know in no uncertain terms that I still did not have a case, and that would be exactly what they would tell us at the meeting. The meeting by the way would be attended by the three reps that have already said no to us. Okay..... onward.....
Click to expand...
most cities have an appeal process.

this cased is a little different, and not sure how the appeals process would work, but you should be able to have an appeal.

do you mind laying out your case to us in just a few sentences?

and once again what is the inspector saying NO to??

if you have not done it, I would take a picture of every building on the property showing similar situation and I take that those do have handrails, prior to all this starting.
 
cda, yes, I've pictures of the other steps with handrails. There is no appeal process for us here in this city. That was made very clear to me, by the inspector's department yesterday. The case, briefly: The stairway, with seven (7) concrete risers, at the time of the accident, had no hand railing and no lighting. The nearest light at the time was 94' away. My husband fell down the steps. It was nighttime. He just could not see the stair, and slipped. He now has cognitive brain impairment, broken teeth, broken glasses and because he was alone and not able to get up he lay at the bottom of the steps for maybe 20 minutes. There was a lot of blood loss, and his coat had to be thrown away. I only say this because I think he is still grieving for that dang coat. He is 72 years of age and we are having a rough time. The city is saying that the stairway is not a means of egress/exit discharge but rather a part of the sidewalk, and as such, not covered by BOCA. They are saying no to my charge that a code violation existed, and with only one handrail, still exits. The landlord owns lots of property here and a credit union, and on and on. This property would be governed by BOCA ed. 1975. That's the story.
 
oldred said:
The city is saying that the stairway is not a means of egress/exit discharge but rather a part of the sidewalk, and as such, not covered by BOCA.
Click to expand...
Typically the means of egress ends when it comes to a public right-of-way. If this stairway is on municipal property it might be considered part of the sidewalk. We have a couple of these in my community. All with handrails, and lights. We also do the snow removal and de-icing. This might be why you are facing such an uphill battle with the local building inspection office. They might just be trying (unsuccessfully) to cover themselves for liability. Either way someone was negligent.

It might be a good idea to ask the building inspector whose property the stairs are on. If it is on municipal property you could bring your concerns to your city council. If it is on private property it is obviously part of the means of egress, otherwise they could just remove the stairs and there would be no code violation.
 
tmurray, it is not municipal property. The complex is privately owned to include the sidewalks and streets. You see that more and more with apartment complexes. It is starting to set in with me that we will have to go to court.....in all probability. We have never been through this before and all I can say is that I see why many people just drop it. There are two other buildings in this complex with stairs and each had handrails and lights installed at the time of construction. Thank you for your comments. Much appreciated.
 
A court of law is the only place you will get the resolution that you need. Even if the building department were to backpedal now and admit there was a code violation you would still need to go to court to receive the type of settelment that you need to pay the initial bills and ongoing medical as well as pain and suffering. I would concentrate on finding a personal injury attorney that will be needed. If you need to go outside of the sphere of influence that the landowner clearly has to do that, so be it. Keep your head up! You will succeed.
 
Yes, JPohling, you are absolutely correct. Between yesterday's phone conversation with the building dept. and more reading on these threads; I agree. Think we will need to go beyond local attorneys. We need to look further, and that is in no way meant to badly reflect on local lawyers. Thank you so very much JP.
 
Thank you Joshua. I'm following the advise I received here, and with time I think it will be fine.......
 
Greetings! Hope one and all are well. Thought I'd provide an update. First, time marches slowly in the "system". We now have legal representation; not much else has changed. We did go out of the area to obtain an attorney. The case has been filed with the courts, and we are currently in the phase of interrogatories. Question, does anyone know of an objective, well informed building code inspector, or prior inspector in the geographical area of Virginia? If you wish to email me, please PM and I'll send the email address. Any suggestions much appreciated. On a personal level it has been rough. My husband can no longer drive, and I'm sure you all can appreciate being told you can't drive anymore and then having your wife replace you behind the wheel. He is now driving from the passenger seat. I'm ready to deliver a second concussion (kidding). I just pray a lot for patience.......
 
I should say an objective, well informed building code inspector who testifies in court as an expert witness. Thank you.
 
& ~ & ~ &



Good to hear from you again **oldred** !

Does the "objective, well informed Building Inspector who

testifies in court as an expert witness [ hopefully well ]",

...have to be from the Virginia area ?

I may know of someone in \ around Herndon.

PM me if you wish.

~ & ~ & ~
 
JPohling, slowly may even be an under statement. :) I'm looking at my 4th melanoma. Surgery will be done the end of this month. I'm very optimistic. They got to clear borders the last 3 times. The slowness of the case didn't bother me until now. I feel a sense of urgency and concern. My husband has been through a lot since he fell down those stairs. I want to have it over and done with...knowing that he will be taken care of now and in the future. It seems we go forward a little and then we pause....forever. I am a lay person, but the means of egress , to me, is a really simple formula. Three steps, exit access, exit and exit discharge.....and it requires light and a handrail. It's not complicated. City Hall, Building Code dept. denies it, and the Fire Department as well. Don't know if I mentioned previously but I went to City Hall and got no where and told them I was going to the Fire Department. By the time I got to the Fire Department they were just hanging up the phone. I could tell by the name it was a Building Code Inspector. So, the Fire Department told me the same thing the Building Code Department did. I even showed them a picture of the front of the apartment and said, "Do you mean to tell me that in the event of fire, the "means of egress" terminated at the beginning of the stairway?" He said yes. I then said, "Does that mean that in the event of a fire we would have reached a safe and public area when standing on the stairs?" He said yes. If there is such a thing as Karma, I think it will be very busy at City Hall, et al. We really like Lynchburg, but I think after what we have been through with its' public officials, we will not settle here. Onward, and excuse me for babbling.
 
oldred said:
JPohling, slowly may even be an under statement. :) I'm looking at my 4th melanoma. Surgery will be done the end of this month. I'm very optimistic. They got to clear borders the last 3 times. The slowness of the case didn't bother me until now. I feel a sense of urgency and concern. My husband has been through a lot since he fell down those stairs. I want to have it over and done with...knowing that he will be taken care of now and in the future. It seems we go forward a little and then we pause....forever. I am a lay person, but the means of egress , to me, is a really simple formula. Three steps, exit access, exit and exit discharge.....and it requires light and a handrail. It's not complicated. City Hall, Building Code dept. denies it, and the Fire Department as well. Don't know if I mentioned previously but I went to City Hall and got no where and told them I was going to the Fire Department. By the time I got to the Fire Department they were just hanging up the phone. I could tell by the name it was a Building Code Inspector. So, the Fire Department told me the same thing the Building Code Department did. I even showed them a picture of the front of the apartment and said, "Do you mean to tell me that in the event of fire, the "means of egress" terminated at the beginning of the stairway?" He said yes. I then said, "Does that mean that in the event of a fire we would have reached a safe and public area when standing on the stairs?" He said yes. If there is such a thing as Karma, I think it will be very busy at City Hall, et al. We really like Lynchburg, but I think after what we have been through with its' public officials, we will not settle here. Onward, and excuse me for babbling.
Click to expand...
I may have mentioned media before

The TV and newspapers always need a story
 
I thought to go to the media. This is such a close and small knit group that I doubt there would be an appropriate response. We have never seen them publish an article of this nature. We are in the judicial system now. Have to let that play out.
 
Curious if this topic has come to a resolution. It has been close to a year since the last update.
 
First, I am sorry that I've not posted in such a long time. Hope that all the faithful and great posters to this blog are doing well. My husband has deteriorated considerably since the fall. He now has Parkinson's which the neurologist credits to the brain injury. It has progressed rapidly. I was informed that this is common when Parkinson's is related to head injury. The fall has taken its' toll on him. I get too emotional discussing it. So on to the status of Lynchburg, VA and its' emphasis on the importance of observing codes introduced for purposes of protecting citizens from bodily harm. It has been 5 years since the fall and we still await a court date. I have been assured that we will see the inside of a courtroom shortly. We wait......... I've not heard from the Lynchburg Building Code Inspectors. We have not been notified that they read the Building Codes and now realize that 7 steps is not a sidewalk, and requires a handrail and lighting. Nor have we heard from the Fire Dept. They still hold to their decision that standing directly in front of a burning building, no more then two feet (2') from the frontage of building, on the steps they call a sidewalk, would be a safe place for the tenants to gather for protection from flames, smoke and fumes.

That's it. Nothing has really changed. At the beginning of this blog I posted pictures of the above referenced and infamous 7 concrete steps........but please, if visiting the Building Inspection Dept. at City Hall........call them a sidewalk. It will make them happy to have their definition of a sidewalk confirmed. Who wants to be blamed for neglect that resulted in traumatic brain injury which in turn led to Parkinson's?

Apologize again for not keeping current. Will advise in the future. Blessings.
 
Never fails to amaze me the lengths landlords will go to to avoid spending any money.
Must be a really small town built way back when?
 
oldred said:
First, I am sorry that I've not posted in such a long time. Hope that all the faithful and great posters to this blog are doing well. My husband has deteriorated considerably since the fall. He now has Parkinson's which the neurologist credits to the brain injury. It has progressed rapidly. I was informed that this is common when Parkinson's is related to head injury. The fall has taken its' toll on him. I get too emotional discussing it. So on to the status of Lynchburg, VA and its' emphasis on the importance of observing codes introduced for purposes of protecting citizens from bodily harm. It has been 5 years since the fall and we still await a court date. I have been assured that we will see the inside of a courtroom shortly. We wait......... I've not heard from the Lynchburg Building Code Inspectors. We have not been notified that they read the Building Codes and now realize that 7 steps is not a sidewalk, and requires a handrail and lighting. Nor have we heard from the Fire Dept. They still hold to their decision that standing directly in front of a burning building, no more then two feet (2') from the frontage of building, on the steps they call a sidewalk, would be a safe place for the tenants to gather for protection from flames, smoke and fumes.

That's it. Nothing has really changed. At the beginning of this blog I posted pictures of the above referenced and infamous 7 concrete steps........but please, if visiting the Building Inspection Dept. at City Hall........call them a sidewalk. It will make them happy to have their definition of a sidewalk confirmed. Who wants to be blamed for neglect that resulted in traumatic brain injury which in turn led to Parkinson's?

Apologize again for not keeping current. Will advise in the future. Blessings.
Click to expand...


Sorry to hear.

Yes the US has the best and worse court system. Not sure why a case takes so long to get heard and resolved.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top