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New Thread - What to recommend to ICC re: Bulletin Board/Forum

Yankee said:
Why is it that there are no (is not) any participation on this board by any ICC staff acting/posting in thier official capacities?
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A few guesses:

1) There is no financial benefit to ICC to for doing so, and

2) They would not be able to claim plausible deniability for all the issues that have been noted, and

3) Doing so would promote the legitimacy of this board and the members concerns, and

4) They have already own & operate a member forum where you can go ask these questions, and

5) See #1
 
CowboyRR said:
A few guesses:1) There is no financial benefit to ICC to for doing so, and

2) They would not be able to claim plausible deniability for all the issues that have been noted, and

3) Doing so would promote the legitimacy of this board and the members concerns, and

4) They have already own & operate a member forum where you can go ask these questions, and

5) See #1
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Well that's just dumb when what is needed is fearlessness.
 
Uncle Bob:

"dsjtecserv" is not connected in any way to the ICC, his name is David S. Johnston, in real life he is the Technical Director for the Vinyl Siding Institute of America, in his own time he is quite a talented photographer. At one time in the past he did serve on a Board on the NFPA chairing their gas and fuels section, he is quite knowledgeable on gas and fuel codes. Where we ran into him was during the sprinkler debates on the old Board, when we were attacking plastic pipe in sprinkler systems he would be called in as the hatchet man to defend the indefensible, cheap plastic. The man is an enigma, how any man can be a talented photographer and work for the plastic siding industry is beyond me, even the environmentalists are challenging all plastic products, yet the Vinyl Siding Institute and Mr. Johnston claim it's, get ready for this, "GREEN".

BTW, to give credit where credit is due, it was RJJ a few years back who did the research and told me who "dsjtecserv" really was.

 
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I have had many visits to his site and he has a good deal of talent with a camera! Have not had the chance to meet him yet.

ICC members do come on the site. They are under the radar, but they leave tracks!

Yes we have invited them and I left a post a while back for Dominic to come on. They would be welcome as any one else is welcome. My feeling is the action here is free flowing and not a script and my be something they don't want to do. We have also had a few x employees. NO NAMES will be used either screen or real. Believe me they are watching and reading. For the life of me I don't know why!
 
RJJ said:
. Believe me they are watching and reading. For the life of me I don't know why!
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Could it be that they want to see how a forum looks when it isn't run by someone whose "singular objective is to enhance the customer experience"...
 
Uncle Bob said:
Uncle Bob found and posted earlier;The more I think about this guy being in charge when the old BB was jerked out from under us; the more disappointed I get in myself for not researching this earlier.

I must be slowing down,

Uncle Bob
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Stop kicking yourself UB - you already have the ICC to do that for you! LOL
 
Frank said:
The board is already composed of active and one retired govenrmental members. Most are local building officals or department directors.http://www.iccsafe.org/AboutICC/directors/Pages/default.aspx
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I think RJJ's point is that these folks are not getting the job done - and we should support somebody that will refuse to drink the "special punch" when they get elected. Unfortunately there is no true accountability for the BOD. If there were, then I doubt the current officers (and several of the other BOD members) would be in the positions they hold - and certainly many of the previous officers would have been "fired" long ago. They keep themselves cloaked pretty deep - thus my point about reading their minutes - there is NO transparency in what they do.
 
View attachment 415Been out of the office. 2,300 miles and $2,100 of repairs, hotels, food and fuel later... Well, anyway. A lot of good stuff here. But we must keep in mind that this Denver thing will just focus on their failed BB + nothing. Sure the cow has many, many problems / issues. But they most likely will not be discussed in Denver. For those that will be attending: I would ask that Uncle Bob take the leed in organizating us on Wednesday night. UB, I ask this for many reasons. I'll pm you here shortly. What say you all? Post Script: Do you think the icc modators would delete my posts? LOL PPS: Just noticed that this thread has 1,115 views. I find that quite interesting. rjj, how many from icc?

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JP: A few that I know of and Jeff just let me know of another this morning. He is much better a flying this thing then I am. I am still learning how all this high tech stuff works. So if the lights go out it might of been me pushing the wrong button.

Texasbo: This is everybody's site. The only rules are be respectful of others. Agree to disagree! No Politics or religious bashing. Jeff had a few more but I have forgotten them. Most importantly we are pretty much free to debate on topics, just keep in mind that it is sponsored By Jeff. So we must not do something offensive with those that employee him no one should create an issue that would cause embarrassment.

This has been a really live thread along with some others. ICC is our code base. We need to find ways to bring the organization into some type of order. We need to keep pressing. Yes Denver is about the BB, but it should provide a guide of just how wide the void really is.
 
"Yes Denver is about the BB, but it should provide a guide of just how wide the void really is. "

Point well taken. Thanks rjj
 
Ther are many post on the "Communities of Interest" board that direct people to this site which are still there for what ever reason.

I suggest they just provide a link to this site along with the archive BB post and scrap their "Communities of Interest". It could be a win win for them. They don't have to spend money they don't have to fix something they broke, Admit they messed up but there is a place equal or better to refer their customers to. Nothing wins back respect for an individual or organization quicker then admitting a mistake and then bending over backwards to ammend it
 
Back on track,

I'll bring my printer in case we want to print or make copies of anything for the meeting.

They did not change the format of the ICC BB because of cost or not being able to maintain it. PHPBB was what they were using and is "FREE" and still a very popular BB format.

I believe some of the reasons for closing the old BB; were the big spitting contest over the sprinklers, exposing the payola for attending the Mini-soda hearings, and some of youse guys bad mouthing the ICC and their new fearless leader.

We will have to deal with the above at the meeting. We just need to decide how best to address those issues; before they come up.

The ICC folks have already informed us that they have a list of grievances that former members and readers of the old BB sent them (about the change) and wrote on the forum; that will be brought up at the meeting. We need to be prepared.

(whisper) There is a way we can record the meeting without creating a problem.

For the record; I am a retired inspector; and an instigator, agitator, originator, and bloviator. I have the least credintials of anyone who will be attending. JP just wants to use my room to smoke cigars and spill drinks so I'll get in trouble.

Things to think about,

Uncle Bob
 
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"The ICC folks have already informed us that they have a list of grievances and problems that will be brought up at the meeting. We need to be prepared."

Grievances and problems with us? The membership using the forum? Granted there were some lively exchanges there, but the Might Mod Dude was usually pretty on top of it. And if they don't like that sometimes folks expressed their disatisfaction with any given part of the org., well, I guess you can call that censorship. But problems with us? i hope I am misunderstanding you UB.

I don't smoke cigars, but I'll be happy to help JP spill drinks.............
 
Fatboy,

I think they have recieved complaints about the old bb being dropped and our complaints while on the old bb. I think they want us to expand on the complaints they recieved and precieved and explain our conserns with the new BB. Not, their complaints; but, as they decided to crack down on the BB; we need to be prepared to address that.

Hope to see you there.

Sorry about the mixup,

Uncle Bob
 
I going home now! LOL!LOL!LOL! I needed that UB. You forgot a few ators! I suggest you all take a bag of fish heads in one of those big plastic bags, cause if the meeting room doesn't stink enough you can always add a little flavor!
 
I have hope for ICC... I renewed my membership yesterday.. and they gave me a code book.. cool..

I believe they are having more sensitivity to those of us who have supported and continue to support them.. listening to us.

I'm looking forward to this meeting... I try to listen more than I speak.. at least initially..
 
peach, "sensitivity" ? Sorry but I'm thinking not. Given their recent history?

I'll be getting into the hotel about 3pm. You all know where to find me. I'm a little sawed off short runt. Glasses, blond hair and a cowboy hat.

I'm sure (certain) they are reading all these posts.

I really respect what MT posted:

"Nothing wins back respect for an individual or organization quicker then admitting a mistake and then bending over backwards to ammend it "

Respect: Hard won and easily lost. Think on it...
 
Yankee,

"Why is it that there are no (is not) any participation on this board by any ICC staff acting/posting in thier official capacities?"

1. They don't know enough about the codes to contribute useful knowledge.

2. Visitors to the forum would "mistakenly assume" that their answers were correct and official ICC interpretations.

3. They couldn't stand the pressure; and the ICC health benefits would be bankrupted.

4. They would get their feelings hurt and demand that this forum be closed.

Thanks for the blessing,

Uncle Bob
 
jpranch said:
Respect: Hard won and easily lost. Think on it...
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For me this has much more to do with Trust. I do not trust ICC leadership. How does one rebuild trust after they have lost it? They need to develop a plan with that as the goal - they need to obtain member input and approval of that plan before implementation- and they need to be accountable for making the plan work. If the plan succeeds then the ICC leaders need to thank the membership and not praise themselves - if it fails they need to turn the reigns over to somebody else. I want the ICC to succeed by serving the public and the members - not serving the personal and political ambitions of the ICC leaders.
 
UB: #2 is spot on!

#1 Don't agree. There are people within ICC that know the codes and work and read them daily. Maybe not in the field.

#3 What pressure. You are free to read, learn and comment. You are free to post if you have something to add or have a different view. I am amazed at times of the different views and experience. This is perhaps the biggest thing we share. In that, is a major shortcoming for ICC staff and employees. They are limited in the scope of expression and thought most likely from some type of corporate policy. Thus they become sterile in the mind and expression in the sake of maintaining employment.

If my employer were to try and bridle my thoughts I would bid him good day and move on. There is always a time to speak ones mind. Sometime we must learn discretion and not create embarrassment, we must always comply to an employer's wishes. If those wishes conflict with our mind set neither the employee nor the Boss's are served. We all have experienced these situation and have learned to deal with them. Those that have been removed from ICC are perhaps the stray sheep. Most often, when a cloud of suppression is in place real productivity and creativity is lost. Then you have a staff of zombies.

#4. first part: TS second part won't happen
 
I don't disagree that there are issues within and around ICC and a lot of that has to do with the "big business" atmosphere/goal, and much of that has to do with the former 10 years of false expectations with the economy.

Ok, so, now we are all slapped down a bit now.

I followed the link to look at the BOD and I see a group of people who are riding the ICC mechanical bull, and from past experiences on other boards I can only say "walk a mile in their shoes" and then criticize.

My gut feeling is that 90% of the BOD are JUST LIKE US.
 
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